Regarding Shorts

[popdrome]

Since I've been away for a while, not having followed all discussions and goings-on,
I did not yet notice the threads regarding short movies - esp. the youtube and vimeo's.

I noticed I recently posted a release of a short that was ALREADY mentioned here in a
thread about vimeo short films. I had no idea, and when I browse these threads,
I come across a lot of short films I have collected, encoded or ripped from sites.

ART just made a joke crowning me 'king of shorts' , I must say I have a lot (over 600)
and I was planning some research and posting (as in 'RELeasing' here) in separate threads.

However I don;t see the point if theres threads filled with both amateur and
professionally made short films. SO I decided (for my self) to make a few rules.

From now on, I'll make a separate [REL] thread for short films if they meet these conditions:

- they are registered on IMDb (or similar official site)
AND:
- duration is longer than 20 minutes

For me, the short film is a great movie genre - needless to say, because they're
an excellent means for both casting agencies and young directors to show off
their talent!

If you're still reading, thanks, as it's only FYI that I use this as a guideline
for my own posts to this great forum. Happy sharing! XD

[FLL]

Thanks for the thoughts popdrome!

Here's my rationale for allowing the various threads for posting of multiple shorts.

- The people posting these threads here are doing us a great service by wading through a site with shorts we'd be interested in, if they needed to make a full REL thread for each it's likely they'd not bother or at least not post as many.

- There's often no IMDB entry readily available, and not much you can say without giving away the entire plot. (Which many synopses do, unfortunately ).

- They are readily available at youtube, vimeo, or another site but often nowhere else. Most people prefer to view them via streaming video rather than eMule download, unless it's blocked outside its country of origin. Sometimes they can't be readily downloaded anyway.

- I suspect that people just go down the list in a thread clicking one after the other, breaking them up into multiple threads makes that tougher.

- Sometimes a short is cute or amusing enough to encourage others to click and view but when you think about elevating it to REL status under typical FLM standards it doesn't seem quite worth it.

Here's what I hate about doing things this way:

- They get lost due to going offline at youtube/vimeo/etc. They have usually been saved and eMule links posted but not always.

- They get lost at FLM. Search is bad at finding them and the threads sink down into the General forum and aren't heard from.

- Because of the ad hoc nature of this at FLM there are no posting standards or standard format really.

- They are very difficult to get a discussion going on using quoting, since multiple shorts are often in a single message and discussions get intertwined. Many would benefit from an easy way to tell others the ones you like most and are most deserving of attention.



There was a thread a while back - Short section yes or not? - talking about whether to make a separate section, and there was no real consensus.

I personally think there should be a separate section for shorts, with defined procedures and standards. The reason I haven't pushed this idea (by offering to do all the work) is I am still unsettled with exactly what standards I'd like to see. I see drawbacks in everything I've come up with so far.

This thread and what I've just written is helping me crystallize some of my thinking though. Unfortunately I must go right now, I'll be back tonight with some ideas/proposals!

[popdrome]

Thanks for the feedback, FLL!

Let me make it clear I have nothing AGAINST the forementioned threads! You point out some advantages and I must say I agree with most of them. The only point I'm making, is that there's shorts and there's shorts!

Nowadays with 1080i enabled HD smart phones out there, _anybody_ can make a cute lil' film and some are great, charming, worth a watch and worth a mention! I therefore love vimeo, dailymotion and youtube because of it.

Yet, the point I'm trying to make is, on this forum, we should apply the same rule to short film *as a genre* as we do to main features, which is: it should be a professionally-made movie, to make it to the FLM [REL] and [REQ] threads. That means, professional cast and crew. IMDb, as discussed elsewhere - is a good way to go.

IMHO, we do not need to create a separate section. I think we're fine the way we are. There will be too much overlap! That's also why I don't like the documentary and music video sections. TV shows section, miniseries section, dvd-extras section, TV commercials, what's next?

But that's just my $0.02 ... sure let it sink and think it over. I'm very interested in the way you guys see it.
Personally, I like the simple idea of LostMoviesArchive.com: suitable if a (female) youth <=18yo with at least 10% screentime. No amateur stuff.
Now... "OT"... ok let's not go there... LOL

[BizarreLoveTriangle]

Yet, the point I'm trying to make is, on this forum, we should apply the same rule to short film *as a genre* as we do to main features, which is: it should be a professionally-made movie, to make it to the FLM [REL] and [REQ] threads. That means, professional cast and crew. IMDb, as discussed elsewhere - is a good way to go.

I don't agree. Of course, "home movies" should not be posted, but IMDB is not a good criterion. Just an example -- the following shorts are *not* listed at IMDB (even though I have the first one on DVD and the second one was recorded from Swedish TV):

[REL] Kalle och Bollhavert (2001)
[REL] Messy Amanda [?] [Short]

Does it mean they shouldn't have been posted here???

My favorite short *is* listed at IMDB, though
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0309811/

IMHO, we do not need to create a separate section. I think we're fine the way we are. There will be too much overlap! That's also why I don't like the documentary and music video sections.

I don't get. You mean music videos should be posted in release section? Or all mixed up in General

Personally, I like the simple idea of LostMoviesArchive.com: suitable if a (female) youth <=18yo with at least 10% screentime. No amateur stuff.

Anybody who prefers these rules can visit LMA, so we don't need to apply the same rules here.

Now... "OT"...

Yes! OT should be the main criterion here, whatever it means...

[ptguardian]

I might as well throw in my 2cents.

I personally like most of the way things are. only problem I can see is when everything is lumped into a single release with several shorts in it. searching and finding becomes difficult. we could have some double posting of releases as result. the way we make releases for movies works. both with function and interaction with the release.

keep in mind FLL has to do his best at pleasing the masses while still making it functional.

on a side note
I am willing to bet that the short BLT is referring to as his favorite is another PEE video. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0309811/.

[loverboy]

Just curious popdrome.....why nothing under 20 minutes?

Of course this also raises the question of what defines a short. Is it strictly the running time or just because IMDB decides to call it one.

Personally, I'd like to see a separate section with a somewhat clearer definition of what can be posted or not. We know IMDB sucks but it's still the yardstick we use for other releases. Obviously other official classification/listing SHOULD be OK but in the absence of anything else (this is the part where I take cover!) it's down to admin to decide what's acceptable. For our part as members, we would need to accept any decision made even if it were not to our liking.

As to suitability in regards to content I don't think this needs discussing here. Over the years we've worn-out the phrase 'OT'......in fact I still think most here haven't got a clue what it means or how it relates to FLM releases!

I'm interpreting popdrome's post as 'intent to release' which is going to further strain what is clearly not a very satisfactory present way of releasing/archiving shorts. Any change is obviously going to involve more work for admin & I wish them luck but would like to assure them of my support in any fresh plans they have.

lb

[ptguardian]

Just curious popdrome.....why nothing under 20 minutes?

Of course this also raises the question of what defines a short. Is it strictly the running time or just because IMDB decides to call it one.

I thought the same thing at first. why nothing under 20 minutes? personally I think it is just the opposite. anything over 20 minutes adding commercials is a half hour show. over 42 minutes it is a hour movie or show slot when you add commercials. under 20 minutes doesn't fit into a time slot add all and is now a filler when a movie or show runs "short" of filling the allowed time slot. hence the term short. we are not a TV station and today there are festivals just featuring shorts but you might get the idea of what I am saying.

I concur with LB "Any change is obviously going to involve more work for admin & I wish them luck but would like to assure them of my support in any fresh plans they have"

[BizarreLoveTriangle]

As to suitability in regards to content I don't think this needs discussing here. Over the years we've worn-out the phrase 'OT'......in fact I still think most here haven't got a clue what it means or how it relates to FLM releases!

OT is anything HOT involving little girls (or boys, whatever you prefer). I hope I don't have to explain it in moar detail...

[starfish21]

a good short recently in much demand here (YELLOW) is only 13min long,
shorts are notoriously difficult to categorise and for that reason i understood that following the recent discussion, it was accepted that 'no change' was the answer.
if the clip can be found using the search function then leave it in the mess it's in.

[loverboy]

OT is anything HOT involving little girls (or boys, whatever you prefer). I hope I don't have to explain it in moar detail...

No, you certainly don't have to explain in more detail your interpretation of OT.....I've already made that point quite clear.

Both popdrome & FLL have opened this up as a discussion to get feedback/ideas from members about releasing shorts. It isn't only your opinion that counts here.....

.....or to put it another way, consider my comments aimed at the engineer, rather than the oil-rag.

lb